Sunday, April 11, 2021

Call for Judgment: Double Skunked

Unpopular, 0-5. Josh

Adminned at 11 Apr 2021 19:29:42 UTC

In the second Crown Match, Clucky has pulled off an ingenious play: he has revealed his Morante mask to be Reali and, on that basis claimed L’Ossa, a trick not otherwise in the game. He carried this out between turns - which is to say, it was not accompanied by a play.

Clucky’s contention is that the text of the Reali mask allows for this:

Once per game, at any time during that Game, name a Trick that is not active in that Game and then (if you meet that Trick’s criteria) score for that Trick

This seems to at the very least strongly imply that it can act as a between-turns scoring opportunity.

However, I read it slightly differently. I see ‘if you meet that Trick’s criteria’ as including the necessity for a Trick to be claimed as a result of a play, on the basis that the definition of a Trick makes it clear that the Play from which it originates is intrinsic:

A Player’s score for a Play is based on the following patterns of cards (or “Tricks”) in their Pocket

Therefore while disclosing the Reali mask at any time is legal, the claim for the play is not.

To be clear, I find this to be a bit of an edge case; I don’t think that Clucky’s argument is without merit and accept that my argument carries with it a degree of hair-splitting. But I do think that my argument is technically correct; if a trick is scored for a play then the play is a criteria for the trick. In any case, I think it’s blurry enough that it should be put to a vote, so here it is.

The passage of this CfJ will result in Clucky’s claim of L’Ossa in the second Crown Match game being considered invalid and being disregarded for the purposes of scoring the match. If a majority of EVCs on this CfJ, including Clucky’s, include the text “Clarity brings wisdom” then Clucky’s Morante reveal and subsequent card play in that game will be considered invalid and he will be free to play his most recent move again.

I’ll not be taking my move until this CfJ is resolved, so no need to worry about amending the results of a closed match. If this fails then I’ll consider it to be implicitly endorsing Clucky’s interpretation (although I still think that multi-choice CfJs need to become a thing).

Comments

Josh: Observer he/they

11-04-2021 17:26:53 UTC

I’ll be making my vote with the EVC rider once voting has started.

Clucky: he/him

11-04-2021 17:34:06 UTC

I named a trick which is not active in the game, I met the trick’s criteria, so I scored for the trick.

“If a trick is scored for a play then the play is a criteria for the trick” I don’t think is a valid line of logic. Just because you *can* score tricks from a play, doesn’t mean its the only way to score tricks.

The wording of the Reali mask says “at any time during that Game”. But under your interpretation, rather being able to use it at any time, you would only be able to use it the narrow window of making a play and then scoring it. That definitely isn’t “any time”

against Clarity brings wisdom

Josh: Observer he/they

11-04-2021 17:38:50 UTC

Ah, okay, voting has started!

for Clarity brings wisdom

Lulu: she/her

11-04-2021 18:14:55 UTC

Clarity brings wisdom against

Kevan: he/him

11-04-2021 18:44:57 UTC

Afraid I don’t follow Josh’s intrinsic line here. All I get from “A Player’s score for a Play is based on the following patterns of cards (or “Tricks”) in their Pocket” is that a “Trick” is a pattern of cards.

Brendan: he/him

11-04-2021 18:52:16 UTC

How does this play differ functionally from Clucky revealing Reali during the previous turn and just claiming Il Toro, L’Aria, and L’Ossa all together?

Josh: Observer he/they

11-04-2021 18:58:42 UTC

@Brendan Clucky went on to play Death, which would prevent him from scoring at all.

pokes:

11-04-2021 19:04:46 UTC

against Clarity brings wisdom.

Clucky: he/him

11-04-2021 19:13:51 UTC

@Brendan because I did it after Josh’s play, in reaction to it.

If Josh had made a different play, I likely would’ve revealed a different mask

lemon: she/her

11-04-2021 19:27:02 UTC

against Clarity brings wisdom

i think clucky’s reali trick there was very neat!

Josh: Observer he/they

11-04-2021 19:29:08 UTC

I’ll accept the tide on this; cov against and I’ll wrap the game up.