Wednesday, October 22, 2008

Proposal: Duel Core

Timed out, 6 votes to 5 (including 2 imperial). Enacted by Kevan.

Adminned at 24 Oct 2008 07:34:49 UTC

[ A reworked version of the earlier proposal, based on feedback. The only comments I’ve knowingly ignored are “somehow factoring in stats” (which I think is better developed through future proposals, one of which I’ll try next), “make dodging have a chance of failure” (again, perhaps better through an add-on proposal), and the general dislike of symmetry (which stat-factoring will fix, and which will go out the window anyway when we start adding weapons).

I’ve dropped the “Surrender” move (you can just make your final moves as dodges, if you’ve got a bad feeling), and made it so that ties are broken by the fewest dodges. ]

Add a new Dynastic Rule, “Duels”:-

Any Clan Lord may announce a Duel, by posting a blog entry whose title begins “Duel:”.

Any Clansman apart from the Clan Lord who announced it may step forward to fight in that Duel by posting a comment to it, stating such an intention, and listing the Items they are holding. The first two Clansmen to do so are considered to be the Duel’s Combatants.

To fight, each Combatant must send a private message to the Clan Lord who announced the Duel, listing ten sequential Combat Moves. Valid Combat Moves are:-

  • Punch.
  • Kick.
  • Grab.
  • Dodge.
  • Use an Item (specifying one of the Items the Clansman was holding when they accepted the Duel).

When a Clan Lord has received a list of ten Combat Moves from each Combatant, he works out the results of the ten Combat Rounds, in sequence. In each Combat Round, the Combatant will perform their specified Combat Move, to the following effect.

  • If one Combatant Punched and the other Kicked, the Punching player is kicked back and takes Damage.
  • If one Combatant Kicked and the other Grabbed, the Kicking player is thrown to the floor and takes Damage.
  • If one Combatant Grabbed and the other Punched, the Grabbing player is intercepted and takes Damage.
  • If a Combatant used an Item, it has whatever effect is defined for using that Item in combat.

If a Combatant is Dead at the end of a round, the Combat ends immediately and its remaining Combat Moves are ignored.

At the end of Combat, the Clansman with the Health nearest to “Superb” (if one exists) is declared the winner. If tied, the Clansman who made the fewest Dodges is the winner (if still tied, there is no winner). The winner gains 1 Honor.

Once the Combat has been processed, the Clan Lord posts the results in a further comment to the Duel’s blog entry, and updates the GNDT stats of the Combatants if required.

If 24 hours have passed since a Clansman stated an intention to fight, but no Combat Moves have been submitted to the Clan Lord for it, that duel is cancelled and that Clansman (or men) who failed to supply Combat Moves each lose 1 Honor.



10-22-2008 13:40:14 UTC



10-22-2008 14:17:29 UTC

imperial I would rather see a turn-by-turn duel instead of 10 rounds all at once.


10-22-2008 14:22:43 UTC

As a straight, slow chain of ten emails, or trying to get people together online at the same time to play it through? I’d like to see it as well, but I’m not sure how we could do it.


10-22-2008 14:28:44 UTC

Make it to where you can’t heal while in a duel and make the posts sticky.


10-22-2008 14:30:44 UTC

To answer your question, though.  It would have to be, as you so eloquently put it, “a straight, slow chain of ten emails,” but with it being turn-by-turn it could be more or less than 10 turns.


10-22-2008 14:30:49 UTC

Ten moves all at once is better—things will actually move along quickly.


10-22-2008 14:36:13 UTC

Maybe it’s worth adding an optional rule for turn-by-turn duels, and running one to see how long it takes.

It could easily take a week, though, between players in different timezones (who could end up being at a disadvantage, if other players are able to fight more often).


10-22-2008 14:57:14 UTC


Hello Sailor:

10-22-2008 14:57:40 UTC

against for now, in favor of a more versatile system that I am currently drafting, which, among other things, allows for multiple types of Duels, and the possibility of even more interesting effects.


10-22-2008 15:16:00 UTC

against .

I don’t like the inflexibility of the list-of-10-moves plan.  The solutions I see are:

1)Make it a duel to first blood.  First one to be damaged loses.  That way, a 1-move-at-a-time duel will usually end in one turn anyway.

2)Send in a deterministic strategy instead of a list of moves. (e.g. I alternate between Punch and Grab, unless I am Wounded or Crippled or my opponent has a worse Health than I do in which case I Dodge.)

Also, if both players do not start with the same Health, it allows whoever has more to use Dodgex10 for an automatic win.


10-22-2008 15:34:14 UTC

First blood seems like it would rule out clever weapon combos. Changing the victory condition to “dealt most damage” makes a lot of sense, though.

I’d love to play a deterministic-combat game, with its own complex language, but I fear it’d go the same way as the robot-programming dynasty did a few years ago - it’d be a bit intimidating and dull to non-programmers, and not much fun for a human moderator to process.


10-22-2008 16:10:45 UTC

against My main concern with all of these combat systems is still the fact that hidden information is being acquired and controlled by players.  As a result, players can directly influence the outcome of these events, defeating the purpose of using hidden information in the first place.

If we’re going to employ the use of hidden information, then the method for gathering and tracking that information needs to be intrinsically neutral.  That means either appointing a person to be responsible for this information who has no motivation in influencing outcomes (the Patriarch I suppose) or programming an automated system for gathering and later providing that information.


10-22-2008 16:13:46 UTC

I’m looking forward to Mortal-Kombat style combos, with finishing moves.


10-22-2008 16:38:10 UTC

I’d be happy to hack together an automated system to accept move orders and only publish them after the second was received, although I might not have time to write it this week.


10-22-2008 17:23:56 UTC

The Monkey Dynasty was code-oriented, and once Clucky had made a script for it things ran fine. It did end too early when Clucky had to idle, though.


10-22-2008 18:50:34 UTC


If a Clan Lord is caught working with another clan member, we can take away their clan powers, no?


10-22-2008 23:46:35 UTC

I was thinking about making a programmable combat list too, like Kevan suggest, but yeah, might be too intimidated to non-coders. Then again, I think this is a fair enough base to start building upon and I’ll start purposing fixes and improvements to this if it passes for


10-22-2008 23:48:38 UTC

Also, I could also create a python script or .net application to resolve combat if it gets too complex (or maybe even php, jsp or whatever so that we can integrate it on the sidebar too, I am not sure what this blog runs on).


10-23-2008 10:31:53 UTC



10-23-2008 12:31:55 UTC



10-23-2008 17:31:01 UTC

for CoV. It works, and we can iron out the difficulties later on.