“the city adds the Possession of your chosing to the Haul” may work better as another afterwards-you-may effect like Riffle, so that it’s clear that I don’t have to pause the processing to ask the question.

Although explicitly changing Plans to also allow sub-options to be specified in advance would also be good.

For BlackGlove, how is

“After the Haul is posted in which this is your Plan, but before that Haul is Distributed, you may once move one Possession from the Inventory of anothr Thief to your own Inventory.”

done?  Is this posted to the haul?  Or just quietly done in inventory?

Just quietly done in the inventory, as written

Target feels too strong. You’re paying less than Stuff, while being able to get the best possible result.

Riffle and Menance I’m not convinced the “Enables the Riffle plan” is enough to make it clear that if you don’t have those, the plans do nothing. (as just from reading the plans it seems like they’d still work)

Well spotted, Clucky.

CoV

Heh, should’ve known better than to scam with this crowd.

The language can be fixed before it’ll meaningfully fire off, though; I’ll even propose it myself.

I wouldn’t sink the whole proposal over it.

@Clucky You can choose the possession but you can’t guarantee that you’ll get it; that’ll be a balancing mechanism.

Now that I think about it, I’m not sure that being able to move a Possession at any time between a Haul being posted and the Distribution is entirely fair. It’s very timing-specific, with the timing currently in favour of folks closer to the UK timezone in which Kevan would be posting new Hauls before some of us are even awake. Either folks closer to the UK timezone would be able to move Possession sooner or sell them sooner to avoid the move.

I think a re-proposal would be better at this point. Perhaps instead of moving a Possession at any time, privately communicating the intention to the City would be better.

@JonathanDark All of that is only true if there’s loads of gloves in circulation, which I’d be surprised about.

I don’t quite follow that. Here’s a scenario:

1) JonathanDark has a Gold Ring in his inventory from a previous Haul.
2) There’s a Black Glove in the Haul. A quorum of Thieves propose giving the Black Glove to Josh.
3) During the UK morning hours, Kevan processes the Distribution, giving Josh the Black Glove.
4) Josh changes his Plan to Riffle.
5) Kevan posts the new Haul.
4) Before JonathanDark is awake, Josh has moved the Gold Ring from JonathanDark’s inventory to his own.

It doesn’t require loads of Black Gloves, just one, as far as I can tell.

Right, but JonathanDark can’t block the theivery at any point, so any player with a glove can steal from him at any time during the Haul.

The advantage that Josh has there is that he has a tiny window between Kevan ending one Haul and starting the next, but tbh that’s an unrelated problem - if there’s a lot of things to change between Hauls then we should widen the gap to prevent it from being a timing window.

Not block the thievery directly, but thwart for sure. “At any time a Thief may remove a Possession from their own inventory to gain Florins equal to its Value.”

The timing here prevents JonathanDark from the opportunity of thwarting the thievery and at least getting value from the potentially stolen Possession. Josh has an advantage of acting before JonathanDark does this, whereas if JonathanDark is awake and can see the new Haul posted first, he can sell the Possession first and deny Josh.

If we’re ok with such timing battles, that’s fine, but I felt like a lot of the discussions on other Proposals have been to remediate actions that depended on successful timing, when possible.

I still feel like that’s an issue with the lack of an airgap between hauls, rather than anything intrinsic to this proposal.

I don’t see the gap between Hauls as the issue there. In the example situation, when the Haul post appeared and announced to the group that Josh had his glove on and was now ready to steal something, both Josh and Jonathan would begin a race to perform either “steal Gold Ring” or “sell Gold Ring”. The slower player would lose out. (The gloved player might even end up wasting the glove, if everyone else was very quick in cashing out.)

for the loophole.

kevan is already against, so if that changes I suppose I’ll change, it’s fine.

Stuff still costs 3, and adds a random possession to the haul. Adding a random possession is clearly worse than adding one of your choice, but you’ve made it cost cheaper.

Maybe we should change it so that like, you could do a random item for 2 or call your item for 4

@Kevan The issue is that, being in your timezone, I am more likely to be online when the Haul post appeared.