Thursday, July 24, 2025

Proposal: Ludonarrative Dissonant [Building Blocks]

Fewer than a quorum not voting AGAINST. Failed 1 vote to 7 by Kevan.

Adminned at 25 Jul 2025 16:15:41 UTC

Reword the Building Block that is called “Bounties” in the Building Blocks wiki page into “Request for Mechanic”, and rewrite it as follows:

A Request for Mechanic is a post in the Story Posts - Votable Matter category which broadly requests a single mechanical or ruleset change. Despite its category, it is not a votable matter and any votes on it are ignored. A Request for Mechanic may be Open or Closed being Open by default and being Closed when set to the ‘Enacted’ or ‘Failed’ status in the post backend. The Enacted Status should be used for successfully completed Request for Mechanic, while Failed should be used for ones that were closed for any other reason.

The Yard may post a Request for Mechanic, or close an open Request for Mechanic, at any time.

The Yard should vote For on any Votable Matter that satisfy the demands of a Request for Mechanic, or clarify which parts of the Votable Matter that the Yard feels said Votable Matter does not meet the goals of the Request for Mechanic.

If the Yard believes that one or more enacted votable matters satisfy the demand of an open Request for Mechanic, then they may set the Request for Mechanic to Enacted and apply any action that appear after “Rewards:” in the Request for Mechanic (if there is any) to each Truck (excluding the Yard) that authored those enacted votable matters.

Second draft; open for revision.

I feel that the current Bounty rule is underused because it does not match what is expected - Bounties is expected to be (if you do a predefined x; get y) as seen in the use of Bounties in The Coregency of ais523 and Josh; but mechanically it fits more of a “the emperor wants your input” role.

Comments

Kevan: Yard he/him

24-07-2025 16:26:44 UTC

From a diff against the ruleset, your changes here are:

1. Renaming Bounties to “Requests for Mechanic”
2. Recommending that the Emperor vote for proposals that address the Request
3. Replacing the dynastically defined Payout with one that the Emperor defines in the Request

1 seems too specific, as it’s not always going to be a request for a mechanic. It might be a fix, or some flavour, or adding more items to a list.

2 seems redundant and mildly risky: if the Emperor asks for a way to slow down the tree-growing mechanic and someone proposes “start a metadynasty” or “repeal all core rules”, the Emperor is encouraged to support that.

3 I’m not sure about. It can’t realistically be abused (it’s nothing an Emperor can’t propose to do anyway), but there’s some risk of Emperor blindness in having them pick the reward each time, rather than the group agreeing on one.

Chiiika: she/her

24-07-2025 16:35:38 UTC

1 is exactly the reason why this proposal is called Ludonarrative Dissonance - I think it is trying to fit into too many roles and at the end it get underused as a helping tool.

I think the additional uses of Bounties can fit dynastically.

Chiiika: she/her

24-07-2025 16:37:09 UTC

2 is yes but it is a should; I feel like should is the mild push and there is the obvious “you aren’t solving anything by starting a meta / repeal all core”.

Chiiika: she/her

24-07-2025 16:39:43 UTC

I’m honestly unsure about 3 - if it is something a emperor is tooling I feel like they should be given the tool to decide; they can always define a dynastic rule that says “when a RfM is enacted, for all truck who wrote those proposal do xyz” but I feel like there could be a additional plug that says to trigger them.

Kevan: Yard he/him

24-07-2025 17:10:54 UTC

against Oh, wait, 3 is actually completely abusable, because Requests aren’t proposals, they’re just posts: players can’t do anything in response to an unpopular or malicious one. A capricious Emperor can post a Request for Mechanic saying “I think the game should be more interesting, the reward for this is winning the dynasty”, and instantly hand that out to anyone.

The same thing is there to a lesser extent with Emperor blindness. They might casually offer some arbitrary resource reward without realising that it would be overpowered to do so. They could even hand it out to someone before the full playerbase had been able to give feedback on that.

To my ear there is more dissonance in an Emperor posting a “Request for Mechanic” that was asking for flavour text, or a repeal, or new items in a list, as these aren’t mechanics. “Bounty” seems like the right word, to me. One dictionary definition is “A reward, inducement, or payment, especially one given by a government for acts deemed beneficial to the state”.

Chiiika: she/her

24-07-2025 17:14:42 UTC

Yup; but for what we can see; Bounty is always used in the sense of we are trying to get to a predefined point but it is dissonant with the fact that it is not pushing you on any formal, defined path. Maybe “Request for Input”?

I see the issue with 3 now; yup.

Darknight: he/him

24-07-2025 20:06:18 UTC

against ngl, i feel more inclined to fully repeal bounties

DoomedIdeas: he/him

24-07-2025 21:15:09 UTC

against

JonathanDark: he/him

24-07-2025 21:16:42 UTC

Same as Darknight. I’d be happier if the concept was simply applied per dynasty that needed it, as it doesn’t get used that much anyway to require a common “template”.

against

Trapdoorspyder: he/him

25-07-2025 02:33:32 UTC

against

Josh: he/they

25-07-2025 06:57:08 UTC

against

Kevan: Yard he/him

25-07-2025 07:54:26 UTC

[Chiiika] The full quote from the same dictionary is ”...such as killing predatory animals, growing certain crops, starting certain industries, or enlisting for military service”. That fits within the usage at BlogNomic, for me. If the government offers to pay me a bounty for every cobra I kill, it isn’t pushing for any particular method of killing.

aria: she/they

25-07-2025 11:32:24 UTC

against