Monday, March 11, 2024

Proposal: Paper Trail

Reached quorum 5 votes to 1. Enacted by Kevan.

Adminned at 13 Mar 2024 11:35:48 UTC

In the rule “Criteria”, add the following subrule named “Audit”:

As part of a Declaration of Victory, the Seeker posting the DoV must include a history of their Private Criteria and corresponding salt in the body of the DoV post. Any DoV which does not contain this information is not considered a valid DoV and should be marked as illegal.


Josh: he/they

11-03-2024 17:09:04 UTC

Might be worth just specifying that a DoV that doesn’t include this is not considered a proper DoV and may be failed or marked illegal, so we don’t end up in an ambiguous position re: haitus or whatever.

JonathanDark: he/him

11-03-2024 17:18:07 UTC

Done, thanks for that suggestion.

Josh: he/they

11-03-2024 22:12:45 UTC


Clucky: he/him

11-03-2024 22:34:34 UTC

we might need some sort of mechanism for “oops I forgot my salt” that doesn’t prevent you from possibly winning

JonathanDark: he/him

11-03-2024 22:53:38 UTC

Like publicly posting your salt every time you change it? I’m not sure how else you can establish a proper audit. Without the salt, the hash can’t be verified.

Clucky: he/him

11-03-2024 23:58:37 UTC

“You made an honest mistake and now we can’t verify a step you took two weeks ago and thus you’re entire win is void” feels harsh to me.

Lying about what’s in your Private Criteria is still against fair play. So I’m not convinced a proper audit is actually needed. It solves rather little, and potentially could cause a lot of problems.

Kevan: City he/him

12-03-2024 09:16:06 UTC

The issue isn’t that someone can lie their way to victory, it’s that they could have made an honest mistake without realising, or genuinely misunderstood how a rule worked. Voters at a DoV will want to be able to confirm that the claimed steps of the victory were valid.

Under the current rule, DoVs will be a little more cagey: if I win and declare victory and a voter asks what my Criteria were, I can tactically choose not to reveal that (in case my DoV fails for other reasons and I’ve now tipped my hand) and see how the conversation goes. Makes sense to be clearer up front and say that every DoV will always require a reveal.



12-03-2024 13:52:05 UTC


Clucky: he/him

12-03-2024 18:15:21 UTC

“You made an honest mistake, wrote your salt down wrong, and now can’t win” feels too harsh to me against


13-03-2024 03:03:54 UTC