Thursday, May 06, 2010

Proposal: Recommended Daily Allowance

Fails 5-6 with 3 DEFs falling to Ienpw. Ienpw.
Unfailed by Ienpw due to new voting rules. (“New voting rules”? There was never any way to fail a proposal 5 votes to 6 after 24 hours.)
Timed out 4-11. Failed by Kevan.

Adminned at 09 May 2010 02:15:47 UTC

In Rule 1.10 (Fair Play), replace “A Voter should not “spam” the BlogNomic blog. What counts as spamming is subjective, but would typically include posting more than ten blog entries in a day, more than ten blog comments in a row, or posting a blog entry of more than 1000 words.” with:-

A Voter should not “spam” the BlogNomic blog. Spamming is defined as posting more than five blog entries in a day, more than five blog comments in a row, or posting a blog entry of more than 1000 words.

Tightening up the definition of spam, per comments on this proposal, so that players know exactly what they can and can’t do. Under the current wording, it’s not clear whether posting three or six or nine blog entries to achieve a clever game effect would be acceptable or abusive - forcing players to guess seems a little tough.

Comments

Klisz:

06-05-2010 16:50:02 UTC

imperial

spikebrennan:

06-05-2010 17:30:46 UTC

For reference, “Vote for my Corrected Proposal to Correct my Proposal Voting Correction Proposal” clocks in at around 635 words.

Keba:

06-05-2010 18:11:40 UTC

for because of the “should”. It‘s only a recommendation.

Josh: Observer he/they

06-05-2010 18:35:17 UTC

for

Klisz:

06-05-2010 18:55:47 UTC

@Keba: Yes, but it’s in the Fair Play rule, so we can ban someone from the game for it - it’s worse than binding.

Igthorn:

06-05-2010 19:17:15 UTC

for

redtara: they/them

06-05-2010 19:27:00 UTC

against per the 1000 word limit. There have been a few very long posts that were perfectly acceptable and non-spammy.

Josh: Observer he/they

06-05-2010 19:28:06 UTC

@Iepnw - I was going to vote the same way for the same reason, but the “should” makes it a recommendation rather than a hard cap, and thus allows for exceptions based on merit.

Kevan: he/him

06-05-2010 19:28:45 UTC

[Darth] We can ban someone from the game for it by making a CfJ that a quorum of players agree with. It wouldn’t automatically trigger and ban them.

Darknight: he/him

06-05-2010 19:53:56 UTC

for

Put:

06-05-2010 20:29:15 UTC

imperial

Wakukee:

06-05-2010 20:42:50 UTC

You can’t put a specific definition on spamming. I mean, what if we get a player that just posts links to naughty sites, but never more than 1000 words or more than once a day? Leave it as somthing to be judged on a case-by-case basis.  against

Bucky:

06-05-2010 22:03:34 UTC

Idle AGAINST in favor of an even vaguer but generally less restrictive rule.

scshunt:

06-05-2010 23:07:44 UTC

imperial

Jumblin McGrumblin:

07-05-2010 00:22:12 UTC

against  I don’t believe that any of the measures taken will be incredibly effective against spammers.  Preventative action is what is needed, not this.

Kevan: he/him

07-05-2010 07:38:57 UTC

[Wakukee] The top end can be judged case-by-case, but I think it’s important to think about the low end - if I’m working on a scam and I realise that I can win the game if I just make six 700-word blog posts, it seems useful for the ruleset to explicitly tell me whether or not that would be okay. (Otherwise we’ll have some cases where someone thinks it’s okay and actually annoys everyone, or where someone politely decides against spamming, only for another player to post the same spam and take the win.)

Kevan: he/him

07-05-2010 08:04:24 UTC

[Jumblin] In case it’s not clear, the Fair Play rule is to define whether or not players can post “spam” type content to the BlogNomic blog, not whether actual spammers can sign up and post Viagra ads.

digibomber:

07-05-2010 14:53:27 UTC

against

Tiberias:

07-05-2010 16:19:23 UTC

against I often post many comments at a time, because there is a backlog of proposals that I need to vote on.

Klisz:

07-05-2010 16:41:22 UTC

@Tiberias: “In a row” means on the same post…

Tiberias:

07-05-2010 17:45:45 UTC

@darth: Where does it say that?  That sort of ambiguity shouldn’t be in the core ruleset.

Klisz:

08-05-2010 03:58:24 UTC

It doesn’t say that, but that’s the standard English definition.

Qwazukee:

08-05-2010 04:20:37 UTC

against

Lol DC that is not a standard English definition, I don’t even think it is implied.

And sometimes, you might need to exceed these limits depending on a situation. Better to leave it subjective.

Tiberias:

08-05-2010 15:04:25 UTC

The standard English definition is something like “consecutively, without interruption”.  That could mean on a single post, or on the blog as a whole in this context.

Keba:

08-05-2010 17:52:56 UTC

CoV against because this would not do anything anymore, because the phrase Voter has been replaced.

Jumblin McGrumblin:

08-05-2010 18:45:10 UTC

@kevan Whoops. I must’ve gotten the earlier post about stopping spammers confused with this one.  Despite this, the rule still limits players on what they could do if they weren’t actually spamming.  If they were spamming, it’d be easy to judge on a case by case basis.  A brightline just isn’t all that helpful here.

dbdougla:

09-05-2010 03:53:08 UTC

against

Kevan: he/him

09-05-2010 09:12:22 UTC

[Jumblin] Oh, it’s still case-by-case (I don’t think we’d CfJ to ban the Emperor if a rule required him to post seven blog posts in the same day) I thought it seemed useful to tell players that “if you have a clever victory scam that only involves posting three blog entries, and they’re each only 600 words in length, then other players definitely won’t be justified in rejecting your DoV for being spammy”, rather than the current vagueness which would scare some people out of making any minor spam-based scams because they don’t know how strict the consensus is.