Monday, June 14, 2010

Proposal: Veto clarification (II)

Times out and fails 1-7. -Bucky

Adminned at 19 Jun 2010 09:41:46 UTC

In section 1.5, change

If the RNG’s most recent Vote is VETO, and that EVC includes the word “Procedural”, the vetoed proposal can be failed immediately by any admin, even if it is not the oldest pending proposal.

Whenever an Admin marks a proposal, CfJ, or DoV as enacted or failed, he must also mark his name, and report the final tally of Votes (or the fact that it was self-killed or vetoed).

Proposals the RNG has Voted to VETO are considered vetoed. Proposals the author has Voted against are considered self-killed unless the RNG has Voted VETO on them, or they have fulfilled one of the other requirements to fail a proposal before the author’s self-kill Vote is placed. Immediately after enacting a proposal that causes a rule with no name to be added to the ruleset, unless the proposal specifically states that the rule should have no name, the enacting admin can change the rule’s title to give it a name, so long as doing so does not change the meaning of any part of the ruleset, nor change any properties of the rule (such as specific words in the title) that the ruleset specifically cares about.

to

If a proposal is vetoed, and the RNG’s last Vote on that proposal includes the word “Procedural”, that proposal can be failed immediately by any admin, even if it is not the oldest pending proposal.

Whenever an Admin marks a proposal, CfJ, or DoV as enacted or failed, he must also mark his name, and report the final tally of Votes (or the fact that it was self-killed or vetoed).

Proposals the RNG has Voted to VETO are considered vetoed unless the RNG has a more recent Vote on that proposal changing the vote to a value other than VETO. Proposals the author has Voted against are considered self-killed unless the RNG has Voted VETO on them, or they have fulfilled one of the other requirements to fail a proposal before the author’s self-kill Vote is placed. Immediately after enacting a proposal that causes a rule with no name to be added to the ruleset, unless the proposal specifically states that the rule should have no name, the enacting admin can change the rule’s title to give it a name, so long as doing so does not change the meaning of any part of the ruleset, nor change any properties of the rule (such as specific words in the title) that the ruleset specifically cares about.

Clarify the “vetoed” state to remove a technical issue* and make procedural vetos rely on that state. Re-submitted now that I’m not idle (didn’t realize my status wasn’t yet changed when I posted).

* There are no EVCs until the proposal is resolved.

Comments

Narya:

14-06-2010 13:51:12 UTC

for

Klisz:

14-06-2010 14:58:49 UTC

against This makes procedural vetoes impossible because of “[...]the RNG’s last Vote on that proposal includes the word “Procedural”[...]”. A vote cannot contain text, only an EVC (as in the current wording).

Qwazukee:

14-06-2010 15:01:21 UTC

against So even “EVC” can’t fix our terminology issues?

Bucky:

14-06-2010 20:52:45 UTC

imperial

Hix:

14-06-2010 22:05:15 UTC

against Why are you suddenly trying to allow allow VETO votes to be changed?  VETO votes and self-kills should not be allowed to change.  When we see a VETO or self-kill, we usually don’t bother voting on that proposal, because it has been rendered impossible to enact.  With this change, we suddenly have to worry about a last-minute CoV.

Narya:

15-06-2010 01:18:09 UTC

“A @‘s Effective Vote Comment with respect to a given Proposal means that @’s Comment to that Proposal (if any) that contains that @’s Vote on the Proposal that is given effect in accordance with Rule 1.4 when the Proposal is Resolved.”

So, technically speaking, there are no EVCs until the proposal is resolved, at which time it’s too late for the procedural/non-procedural distinction.  This was an attempt to resolve that.

Hix:

15-06-2010 03:19:54 UTC

Then fix the definition of EVC if that’s what’s really the problem.

How about:

“A @‘s Effective Vote Comment with respect to a given Votable Matter is defined as that @‘s Comment to that Votable Matter (if any) that contains that @‘s Vote.”

Further wordiness along the lines of “as described/defined in Rule 1.4 ‘Voting’” would be acceptable, but isn’t necessary.  There’s already a Glossary Entry to clarify the definition of Vote as a noun, and Rule 1.4 already says that new Votes cancel old “Votes”, so that the old “Votes” aren’t really Votes anymore.

Darknight: he/him

15-06-2010 21:12:41 UTC

against

Galdyn:

19-06-2010 01:13:42 UTC

against

lilomar:

19-06-2010 16:25:56 UTC

against