Thursday, August 16, 2012

Proposal: Become a Master Baker


Adminned at 17 Aug 2012 21:14:42 UTC

Add a new rule called “Winning Conditions”.  Add a subrule to “Winning Conditions” with the following text:

These bakers are judged by their delicious pies,
And so Pie Points shall bring their success or demise.
But how many points before one claims the crown?
“50 points marks a victor!” says the King of Town.

What the heck are Pie Points, then?  Who knows?  My thought is that we could assign Pie Points as an intrinsic value to each kind of pie: Empty is worth 0, Apple worth 1, Dutch worth 3 (intentionally rewarding more upgrades with exponentially more points), and so on.  Other thoughts:

1) This doesn’t have to be the only winning condition (maybe money could be another?)
2) Maybe instead of having pies impart pie points automatically, we have to trade a pie in to redeem its value

But both of those can be added on if/when we pass this victory condition.  I just feel like having some potential goal in place, even with no way to get there yet, will help us have more direction in designing the play.



08-16-2012 08:08:37 UTC

I’d also like to have some distant aim, but does this proposal set such? Is victor allowed to achieve victory?
What if someone occasionally jumps from 49 to 51 ponits?


08-16-2012 12:54:41 UTC

You all know the standards around here better than me.  Is “being the victor” really so different from “achieving victory” that it’s an unacceptable ambiguity? 

Same with the “50 points” versus “at least 50 points.”  Not allowing victory to be declared with 51 points (under this rule) would be like saying “August has 31 days, therefore it does not have 28 days.”  I admit this isn’t as strong a case as the victory issue, but isn’t that just how numbers work?

I understand the need for clarity, but you have to draw the line somewhere on what constitutes logical common ground.  If not, then what’s preventing everyone from declaring victory now, based solely upon the logic that “There’s nothing that says I can’t”?

I could have been more specific, but forcing all proposals to read like depositions would cut into the flavor somewhat.  Would an extra clarifying line like “(A Baker who has at least 50 Pie Points has achieved victory)” settle this?


08-16-2012 14:06:00 UTC

I believe that “50 points marks a victor” is enough to set a victory condition; but the ambiguity of “exactly 50 points” against “at least 50 points” is there. It could be fixed easily, of course (my apologies to your alexandrines);
but I’m against anyway because I do not like this system, as it relies way too much on the daily actions (if we don’t quickly set up another, more profitable system to get pies, this victory condition will turn the game into “after about one month of playing, the player who has been present the most days since the beginning of the dynasty achieves victory”).


08-16-2012 14:33:10 UTC

against I like the theme-tying-in-poetry, but I would just prefer that the actual rule text is written in plain English so as to avoid ambiguity/loopholes/misunderstandings.


08-16-2012 14:39:32 UTC



08-16-2012 16:16:15 UTC

against Keep the actual rules in straight english please.

Furthermore, I don’t want the victory condition to be so… grindy. Like, it would just turn into “wait X number of days”. Pies generation should be used for various mechanics, and those mechanics should be used to determine victory.


08-16-2012 22:35:04 UTC

against Very well.  I know when I’m beat.

And the “daily action” problem that many of us seem to have could be solved by repealing the one-upgrade-per-day rule.  It could become one Empty per day, with unlimited upgrades.  But that is a thought for another day.


08-17-2012 16:42:52 UTC

Unlimited upgrades seems too much - maybe make them have a cost or something.
And about the one Empty per day: apparently Quirck has been giving one Empty Pie per day to everyone who did not use their daily upgrade. I’m pretty sure this is currently illegal, so we should probably make a CfJ to make it legal.


08-17-2012 17:27:02 UTC

Illegal? “If a Baker does not perform this action during a day, they gain one Empty Pie at the end of that day.”


08-17-2012 19:26:19 UTC

Oh. I missed that part, sorry.