Thursday, January 16, 2025

Proposal: The Exotic Toolkit

Fails with 5 votes to 3 -SingularByte

Adminned at 17 Jan 2025 20:46:46 UTC

Add a new dynastic rule, called Lock and Key {I}:

Each Mastermind has a Passkey, which is a string of nine to sixteen characters (which may be English alphabet letters or spaces) that comprise a recognisable sequence of words. If a Mastermind does not have a Passkey then they may set their Passkey to any legal value.

As a Heist Action, if there are no open Lockpick posts, any Participant who is not a Mastermind may make a Lockpick post to the blog, which is an official post in the Story Posts category which has a title of ‘Lockpick attempt’ and a body that contains nothing except the author’s guesses as to the two Passkeys. Each Mastermind should respond to that post with a FOR or AGAINST mark, signifying whether the content of the post contains their Passkey. If both responses to a Passkey post are FOR then its author may once set one subrule to this rule to be Mutable, and both Masterminds should immediately change their Passkeys. Otherwise it ceases to be a Lockpick Post within 48 hours of having been posted.

All Immutable subrules to this rule are flavour text.

Add the following as a new subrule to Lock and Key {I}, called Dynomite {I}:

As a Heist Action a Participant may repeal one Mutable rule, then repeal this rule.

Add the following as a new subrule to Lock and Key {I}, called Electronic Identification Spoofer {I}:

Any Participant may change the first line of bulleted list in the rule Tools of the Trade {M} to read as followes, and then repeal this rule:

* Every word in the amended rule is a word in the English language or the name of a Participant.

Comments

ais523: Mastermind

16-01-2025 16:42:08 UTC

Ugh, we submitted our proposals at almost exactly the same time. Is there any easy way to tell which one arrived at the blog first? If not, resolving them in the correct order might be difficult, if we can’t figure it out.

I copy-and-pasted my proposal from an editor into the edit box, but wrote the flavour text manually, so would have taken slightly longer between page load and submission than you did.

ais523: Mastermind

16-01-2025 16:44:53 UTC

As for feedback on the proposal itself: this needs to be clearer about how passkeys are set (currently there is no way to set them), and to give us time to change them if someone is guessing passkeys rapid-fire.

This also runs into a restriction on transmutation that I added to “more security”, but I can amend my proposal to lift that restriction to the extent that this works.

Josh: Mastermind he/they

16-01-2025 16:45:28 UTC

I pasted mine and posted it basically instantly so I think we can assume this one was second.

Josh: Mastermind he/they

16-01-2025 16:47:42 UTC

I think the restriction that there can only be one open Passkey post at a time and the stipulation that Masterminds have to change their Passkey immediately upon a correct guess should prevent milling the same Passkeys.

ais523: Mastermind

16-01-2025 16:48:20 UTC

Right, the problem is that the timestamp of yours is basically correct, but the timestamp of mine is slightly early, and I don’t know whether it was more or less than 2 minutes early.

Josh: Mastermind he/they

16-01-2025 17:05:09 UTC

Given the unprovability of it, and the fact that it makes no difference, I suggest we trust the timestamps.

ais523: Mastermind

16-01-2025 17:11:46 UTC

(re: “I think the restriction…”) Well, if I’m the first Mastermind to vote, I can’t change my passkey immediately upon a correct guess, I can only change it once I see the second FOR vote.

I think perhaps Masterminds should change their passkeys at the time when they vote FOR on a Lockpick Attempt (because at that point, the previous passkey will be known already).

ais523: Mastermind

16-01-2025 17:37:43 UTC

Hmm, another suggestion: could you require the passkeys to contain EFF Words only? That would make this mechanic easier to tie into other existing mechanics in the dynasty.

SingularByte: he/him

16-01-2025 21:14:20 UTC

against  I’m not sure I’m fond of this one. The guesses will be borderline impossible and, even if ways are added to make them easier, the reward doesn’t seem that worthwhile. They’re symmetrical in the sense that any team can use them so there’s no real benefit to unlocking them, and there would be nothing to stop people just proposing them as regular mutable rules if they wanted them.

JonathanDark: he/him

16-01-2025 22:55:04 UTC

against

Habanero:

17-01-2025 00:29:12 UTC

for Eh, I quite like it. They’re one time use so in practice the team that unlocks them will use them, and the reason you’d put things as a subrule of this rule instead of as a mutable rule is because this provides a cost for more powerful actions (you need to know the passkey)

ais523: Mastermind

17-01-2025 01:33:42 UTC

imperial I guess my position here is “mechanics where the Masterminds track information that’s kept secret from each other are a good idea, but I’m not a huge fan of this implementation”, partly because there’s no real incentive for the masterminds to ever disclose their keys (you need both keys to do anything useful, and disclosing your key without knowing the other one is just asking for it to be exploited by the other team), and because the reward for doing so is fairly small. (Although this proposal did make me realise that Josh and Habanero might potentially have an advantage when trying dynasty-ending scams under the current ruleset because their names are English words already, so they would effectively get the Electronic Identification Spoofer bonus automatically. That said, that bonus seems too small to me to be likely to have a significant effect on the dynasty – I imagine that players who could adjust the mutable rules to such an extent that putting their own name in them were at all useful would also be able to adjust the mutable rules to an extent that they could legally do that.)

I think a better implementation would be along the line of creating secret targets (that become non-secret upon being achieved), in addition to the publicly tracked targets we have at the moment (although I’m not sure what the details should be). That would both make the “conventional” gameplay of the dynasty more interesting, and potentially lead to situations where players tried to sneak secret targets into proposals without the other team realising they were targets, in order to save on Heist Actions.

Josh: Mastermind he/they

17-01-2025 10:19:04 UTC

I think it’s important to keep room for future mechanics - it’s easy to see room for Mastermind Actions that have a cost of revealing a letter of their Passkey to a member of their team, say.

Raven1207: he/they

17-01-2025 16:39:15 UTC

for

Brendan: he/him

17-01-2025 19:19:46 UTC

against “Each Mastermind should respond to that post…” and “If both responses to a Passkey post are FOR…” aren’t actually connected; any player could just comment FOR twice on their own Lockpick post and have it count as a success.

ais523: Mastermind

17-01-2025 19:50:06 UTC

against Good catch.

Janet: she/her

17-01-2025 19:52:58 UTC

against