Monday, February 02, 2015

Story Post: Trial: Now that we’re properly paranoid

It’s impossible to give ais523 the Disabled condition as required.  Therefore, cannot be enacted.  Also, it’s more than 48 hours old, therefore it fails. -Bucky

Adminned at 04 Feb 2015 19:46:22 UTC

I accuse ais523 of being an Android.

Here’s what Brendan had to say on the subject:

]I know I said I was too busy steering this thing to be bothered with some circuit court nonsense, but as Pilot, that spot on our perfect mission record rankles. I include myself in the blame for our fumbled “Training Drill,” but it would have gone fine if not for one player: ais523, who claims to be too busy to play in this Dynasty, but who managed to bring down one mission and nearly fail another anyway. Frankly, I don’t care even if they are Human. I just want to see them tossed in the coolant tank for failing to pull their weight.

I mostly agree with Brendan, but I have additional arguments.

One common tactic Androids-analogues use in other Werewolf variants is to feign inactivity to avoid accidentally doing suspicious things.  And when I analyzed ais523’s voting record on recent* controversial** votable matters, a clear pattern emerged.  Namely, ais523 did not vote on any of them.  Not voting on some of them might be simple inactivity.  But I find it implausible that he didn’t have an opinion on any of the hot topics.  More likely, he is deliberately abstaining so that he won’t get caught voting in a suspicious manner.

*the last one I could find was “Blind man’s bot”.
**‘controversial’ meaning at least one person voted each way.



02-02-2015 07:43:36 UTC

From my point of view, I’m still trying to work out how to best achieve the victory condition. In particular, it’s far from clear that Humans should be helping out Humans (and Androids helping out Androids). Likewise, I couldn’t actually see an advantage from completing missions.

At the time of the first mission, the Human/Android statuses hadn’t been rolled. I decided not to participate to see if I became an Android. Next time I checked BlogNomic, the deadline had passed. However, I also fail to see any benefit that individual humans gain from succeeding missions. It might help out the cause of Humanity as a whole, but the likely only effect of that is to prolong the dynasty.

From the point of view of someone who’s busy, a simpler dynasty gives me more chances to manoeuvre a victory; even as a Human, I benefit from a lack of subroutines, and thus from systems becoming Catastrophic faster.

Also, I note that the only currently rules-defined effect of Bucky’s votable matter (apart from blocking secret dynastic actions, none of which I have taken anyway) is to prevent me helping out with missions. Not to prevent me being selected for them; to prevent me doing anything to help out with them if I am. Thus, Trials seem to be entirely counterproductive in the current ruleset.

All that said, if you guys want to persist in playing Werewolf rather than in playing Nomic, I’m fine with that, and will just sit back and seek chances to win while you’re busy aiming towards the win condition of the wrong game. (I’d like to mention in passing the historical fact that almost every faction-based dynasty is won by a cross-factional alliance. If there are any Werewolves out there who want to form one with me, I’d be happy to.)


02-02-2015 14:40:06 UTC

Bullshit. I’m sorry but this is totally wrong. As ais523 has said, he has been busy during this Dynasty and has not been able to participate as much. Just cause they are not keeping up with missions doesn’t mean you need to toast them for being an Android. I don’t believe it. against  against  against  against  against


02-02-2015 15:49:29 UTC

“if you guys want to persist in playing Werewolf rather than in playing Nomic” - would be more convincing if you were voting or writing proposals.  You’re not.

Brendan: he/him

02-02-2015 15:50:22 UTC


Josh: he/they

02-02-2015 17:12:24 UTC

Brendan and Bucky teaming up like this makes me a little anxious.

The anxiety is a bit tempered by the fact that it’s ais, though, who I was also curious about. His response above convinces me that I should vote for - if not because he’s an Android, because he freely admits to working against the Humans as a team, so his continued experience of the game is in any case a net negative for me.

Brendan: he/him

02-02-2015 18:23:30 UTC

The innocent have nothing to fear, Josh.

RaichuKFM: she/her

02-02-2015 18:25:39 UTC

for Josh seems to have the right of it, and the Mediator is someone that I think I can trust.


02-02-2015 19:33:54 UTC



02-02-2015 20:47:55 UTC



02-02-2015 22:58:23 UTC



03-02-2015 01:15:10 UTC

Remember we are playing a Nomic - anyone who says the Humans or the Androids are a team without reserve is putting up a false pretense. Ultimately, only one can win. This is factually correct and applies to every player, therefore, ais523 is not harboring anti-Human sentiments.

Josh: he/they

03-02-2015 08:18:02 UTC

Sure, but in that case he’s still harbouring anti-me sentiments. Whichever game we’re playing, the sensible response is to get him out of the way.

You seem to be going in really hard in his defence, ayesdeeef. Do you know something the rest of us don’t?


03-02-2015 13:26:38 UTC

I’m surprised. I thought Brendan was going to vote AGAINST.

@Bucky: I have a tendency to not propose or vote much no matter what nomic I’m in. It’s a deficiency in my style (although it is fun to beat other people with their own rules). It’s also reached the point that when I propose anything at all, other than an emergency fix to the core rules (or if I’m the Emperor), people accuse me of scamming.


04-02-2015 01:25:34 UTC

I guess I feel bad that he has to sit on the side over a cooked up case, Josh. The lack of cerebral actions is a travesty.

Also, Bucky/Brendan is annoying me, but that’s largely unrelated.